New Burma DF map

[=CfC=Bounder]

Last night we were talking about a new Burma map and I have the location now.

In 1942 the allies were pushed north and west towards the border with Inida. The coast on the west side of Burma has a few nicely spaced airfields and hills which should make for a nice location.

The difficulty is getting a good balance in a/c types. There is nothing really on the allied side that turns like a KI43 in around 15 secs....apart from the Gladiator which is then subject to a huge speed disadvantage.

I will add the Gladiator, the Mohawk (used in India) and the Hurricane MkII to the fleet which already has the Hawk 81-A2 and P40E.

The question is...do you want the Spitfire Vc (it was in India)? Invariably it will end up as the Spitfire versus the KI43.

Bounder :-\

[CFC_Conky]

Hi Bounder,

I fly the Ki-43 fairly often in our df's and the Spitty will have to slow-turn fight with it or BnZ and hope for lucky hit if the Oscar knows it's there. The Hurricane is actually a better kite against it and the Mohawk will probably do well too. I believe the IJA had some Ki-44's in Burma so that could be an option as well.

Pip, pip,
Conky

[=CfC=Bounder]

Hi Conky,

We found the other night that due to the way CfC fight (low turning battles), it is pretty difficult to fight the KI43.

The KI44 is much nearer to the general performance of the other Red a/c with a turn of some 20secs. but it is 80kph faster than the Hurri!

I think what I might try is putting in some adverse weather (turbulence/gusts/cloud) to make strategy more important and give Reds more of a balanced fight....I know IRL it was different as they fought in the 10-15000ft bracket.

I could also limit the number of KI43b's and c's so that with a predominance of a's, the armament will be weak and require more accurate shooting. Interestingly, we all agreed that fighting an AI KI43 seemed not much of a problem....it is the ability to utilise the 15sec. turning FM as a human that probably causes the imbalance in our DF's.

From what I have read, the Spitfires did not arrive until 1943, so I think we will try the above first and then introduce the Spit if we are still getting issues.

Any other ideas?

Bounder :-\

[=CfC=Father Ted]

Just as an experiment, could we have air-spawns at 15000ft?  I know it's a bit arcadey, but it might add a different dynamic.  Also, with more air and less ground to look at, spotting might be easier.

[CFC_Conky]

The Dutch operated a few CW-21 Demons in the East Indies and I believe a few made their way to China. I haven't flown it much but it might be competitive against the Oscar. Too bad the I-16 with the CW engine wasn't available in Burma!

High altitude spawning works but df's tend to get a bit spread out; the same problem occurs when fighting with jets. Against the ai it's workable because you can script things but otherwise it might be impractical unless we have a large group of players.

Pip, pip,
Conky

[=CfC=Bounder]

The Dutch operated a few CW-21 Demons in the East Indies and I believe a few made their way to China. I haven't flown it much but it might be competitive against the Oscar. Too bad the I-16 with the CW engine wasn't available in Burma!

High altitude spawning works but df's tend to get a bit spread out; the same problem occurs when fighting with jets. Against the ai it's workable because you can script things but otherwise it might be impractical unless we have a large group of players.

Pip, pip,
Conky

Will add the CW21 Conky and see how it goes. Has an impressive top speed at sea level and turns only a couple of seconds slower than the Oscar.....might prove the answer! Some forfeit of historical fact is necessary sometimes, especially in a balanced DF mission.

Ted.....I find air spawning the ultimate scene killer....but that is personal. Last resort in my view. Unless we all continuously spawn at high level and do away with RRR it won't really work. I can remember a few high level spawning co-ops in the old  Chuffy's missions (such as escorting B17's over Germany in P47's) and the battle lasted one engagement before everyone lost the action. Works with large numbers and no RRR but I think unless you introduced a lot of AI it would end in a scenic flight and no more!

Bounder :-\

[=CfC=Father Ted]

I'll bow to your superior knowledge chaps!  I agree that taking off and landing are all part of the action Bounder.  I can also see that flying about  up high would cause a loss of action-focus.  I thought about the idea because it's one of the common complaints about MP on the RoF forums - no one flies high enough to enable real-world advantages/disadvantages of the plane-set to become apparent.

[CFC_Conky]

The Dutch operated a few CW-21 Demons in the East Indies and I believe a few made their way to China. I haven't flown it much but it might be competitive against the Oscar. Too bad the I-16 with the CW engine wasn't available in Burma!

High altitude spawning works but df's tend to get a bit spread out; the same problem occurs when fighting with jets. Against the ai it's workable because you can script things but otherwise it might be impractical unless we have a large group of players.

Pip, pip,
Conky

Will add the CW21 Conky and see how it goes. Has an impressive top speed at sea level and turns only a couple of seconds slower than the Oscar.....might prove the answer! Some forfeit of historical fact is necessary sometimes, especially in a balanced DF mission.

Ted.....I find air spawning the ultimate scene killer....but that is personal. Last resort in my view. Unless we all continuously spawn at high level and do away with RRR it won't really work. I can remember a few high level spawning co-ops in the old  Chuffy's missions (such as escorting B17's over Germany in P47's) and the battle lasted one engagement before everyone lost the action. Works with large numbers and no RRR but I think unless you introduced a lot of AI it would end in a scenic flight and no more!

Bounder :-\

Hi Bounder,

Went fro a short pootle in the CW-21 last night against a KI-43-I, I think the Demon will be an excellent foil to the Oscar.

Pip, pip



Ted,

I believe air spawning works best at the start of a non-mds mission in order to have everyone in the same piece of sky for the first act, i.e. bomber escort followed by the fighters being turned loose to strafe targets of opportunity on their way home. Alternatively, it can be used in Dieppe-style mds missions where the flight distances are shorter.

Pip, pip.

[John Cartwright]

Yes Fitz, cute little plane and with the .5 and .303 option lights the Ki up nicely and can manouver with it. Overheats quickly and takes a while to cool though. Snaps a bit at high speed turn.

[=CfC=Bounder]

The new Burma DF mission (1942) should be ready for this Thursday.

There are a number of issues with water levels as we found on the other Burma DF (Mingaladon area) which has meant that no ships will feature in the river estuaries. In addition, the seaplane landings are interesting with about ten feet of air between the floats and the water!

Detail of the mission is as below. The a/c set features RAF, Flying Tiger and Chinese Air Force a/c including the CW-21. The Nak seaplane is available from the seaplane base for Blue.

Bounder

[CFC_Conky]

Hi Bounder,

You can have ships move in rivers/estuaries but it's devilishly complicated to do so (at least for me!  ), I'd just put some stationary ships in and imagine they are pootling along verrrrrry slowly  .

Pip, pip,
Conky

[=CfC=Bounder]

Hi Bounder,

You can have ships move in rivers/estuaries but it's devilishly complicated to do so (at least for me!  ), I'd just put some stationary ships in and imagine they are pootling along verrrrrry slowly  .

Pip, pip,
Conky

The water levels are I'm afraid "bugged". If you place a ship in the water in shows it airborne at about 10-30ft above the water. This is a common problem on some of the modded maps when they don't get the levels correct. I had the same problem with the Mingaladon map although by moving the ships around it was possible to place some of them with just the rudders still out of the water  (so torpedos don't work). Unfortunately not on the Mayu River estuary....it is all bugged.

South Burma and Alps maps are the worst for this although some like Fifi's lake in our Slovakia mission are only in error by a few feet. The only difficulty for us is when you land to RRR your Nak seaplane! Imagine you are flying a Jumbo and all is well!

Bounder